Justice

[vardhamana]

What is the meaning of Justice?






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[kaybul]

jus·tice/ˈjəstis/
Noun:
Just behavior or treatment.
The quality of being fair and reasonable.


there is the meaning of Justice.

[vardhamana]

Sept 2, 2012 1:03:52 GMT -5 kaybul said:

jus·tice/ˈjəstis/
Noun:
Just behavior or treatment.
The quality of being fair and reasonable.


there is the meaning of Justice.

I'm sorry, I should have clarified:

I did not mean "What is the definition of the word Justice?" rather:

What would you define as Just behavior? What sort of actions or behaviors would you consider to be Just ones?

[Magic Omania]

I have thought deeply for a long time about this and have come to the conclusion that justice is the act of helping somebody in dire need out of pure selflessness.

[vardhamana]

So, if you help someone else for any reason other then that, or if you get any sort of reward for your action, you are not being Just then?

[Magic Omania]

No, pure justice is as I stated above. However, justice can coincide with other factors of helping or assistance. There are "just actions" within the works toward a less important cause. Receiving a reward does not make the action unjust. Often times, people receive rewards for a service that they would have provided either way.

[vardhamana]

So, would you say it is better, or more beneficial, or more right, for a person to be just then unjust?

[Magic Omania]

I would indeed say that.

[vardhamana]

Why? What reason or proof can you give that it is better to be just then unjust?

[Magic Omania]

What proof do you have of the contrary? Just actions create friendships and trust within society. Take this for an example:

A friend once told me a story of how his uncle was once in a severe automobile accident. Apparently the uncle was driving with his wife as a passenger. The uncle was knocked unconscious and his wife was too hurt to help him. Many vehicles passed the accident without a second thought, but one man decided to stop and help these strangers. He knew what to do in such a situation, so he contacted the authorities and provided medical aid to the crash victims. The man's actions ended up saving the life of my friend's uncle. Now they (the uncle, his wife, and the man) have an eternal friendship of gratitude and love.

Logically, this story has no relevance to a random individual, but the human mind does not think solely in terms of logic. People think with a combination of logic and emotion. The incredible emotion experienced by these people must have improved their lives, making that man's just actions a betterment of society.

[vardhamana]

Ok, so what your giving in the example above is a reason why it might be beneficial to be Just-other people will interact with you more favorably.

Putting that aside for a minute, would you say someone should still be Just purely for the sake of being just, even without recieving any possible benefit from it?

To give an example of what I mean:

Let us imagine a Just man, a simple and honorable man who wants not to appear good, but to be good. We must deprive him of the appearance, since if he appears to be just, the appearance of justice will bring him recognition and rewards, and then it will not be clear whether his motive for being just was a desire for justice or a desire for the rewards and recognition.
Despite doing nothing wrong, he must have the worst possible reputation for injustice. Then, if it is unaffected by disgrace and its consequences, the purity of his justice will have been truly tested. Let him live out his life like this, without any change, until the day of his death, appearing to be unjust though actually being just.

Would you still agree it is better to act Justly then Unjustly in such a case, and if yes, why?

[Magic Omania]

In such a situation, a truly just person would decline some of the fame so as to inform the public that they simply wish to do good things for people and expect nothing from it. If society sees injustice in this, then this is a fault of society, and not the person. Plus, from a personal standpoint, I do not trouble myself with what onlookers think of my actions. If they are well intended and help somebody, then it makes me feel good to know that I helped that particular person. The judgement of others does nothing to effect true justice. Just actions are always greater than unjust actions, despite any criticisms received.

[vardhamana]

Sept 20, 2012 22:14:46 GMT -5 Magic Omania said:

In such a situation, a truly just person would decline some of the fame so as to inform the public that they simply wish to do good things for people and expect nothing from it.

But he's not getting any fame (unless you count infamy)

Sept 20, 2012 22:14:46 GMT -5 Magic Omania said:

Just actions are always greater than unjust actions, despite any criticisms received.

And why do you say that?

[Little K-B]

Sept 21, 2012 10:04:00 GMT -5 vardhamana said:

Sept 20, 2012 22:14:46 GMT -5 Magic Omania said:

In such a situation, a truly just person would decline some of the fame so as to inform the public that they simply wish to do good things for people and expect nothing from it.

But he's not getting any fame (unless you count infamy)

Sept 20, 2012 22:14:46 GMT -5 Magic Omania said:

Just actions are always greater than unjust actions, despite any criticisms received.

And why do you say that?

Well for starters, a just action isn't always universely perceived as how the person(s) committing the action perceive it to be. When we begin talking about what makes something just or unjust there are no clear-cut tangible evidence for why it was just that everyone agrees with. Even the most hated, vile crimes that most people say would be unjust, are met with those that believe it to be just, and thus criticism is received.

When looking back upon things, we generally tend to find that the actions done by others are either clearly just or unjust, which is explained by the Hindsight Bias.

[vardhamana]

Ok Mitch, you are saying that there is no objective morality, and it is all in the eye of the beholder, correct?

However, Magic Omania did give an objective definition of Justice, so I am questioning him on the details of that.